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Jimmy9190
Dodge Dakota
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2/20/2008
12:00:08
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 Subject: 180Tstat in stock engine
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I have a 2001 3.9 and am trying to get rid of the ping. The engine is completely stock, running Autolite Platinum 5224's, Napa cap, rotor and wires. I did remove the elbow off the air box and the rubber flap. Will a 180 degree thermostat work and help lower the engine temperature on a stock engine or is it only beneficial to one with more mods done to it? I live in Florida and it rarely gets below 60 degrees here if that matters.
The ping has got to go. Any help is greatly appreciated.
Jimmy
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daddio
Dodge Dakota
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2/20/2008
12:35:27
| RE: 180Tstat in stock engine
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it should help. be careful here and buy a "good" brand like Stant. the cheapy A/Z tstats may open sooner than 180 and trip a code for the engine running too cold for too long. happened to me.
also, are those Autolite 5224's the stock heat range? if so drop to one range colder. that will help too.
have you checked for vacuum leaks? what do the plugs look like?
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Jimmy9190
Dodge Dakota
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2/20/2008
13:03:28
| RE: 180Tstat in stock engine
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Thanks Daddio. From what I read here, mostly from Larry the AP 5224's are about half a step colder than stock range. It's the equivalent of the Champion truck plug for the 3.9. Truck is running real good with them in it, even better than with 3923's. The 3923's that came out of it a few weeks ago looked OK, they had not been in the engine but a couple months when the ping came back but they were a light to medium gray color. I haven't done a vacuum test, I don't own a vacuum gauge. But I don't have any of the signs of vacuum leak, truck gets about 21 mpg in town and maybe 24 or 25 highway, has no hesitation or stalling out, doesn't burn any oil and the belly pan is clean. No oil in the bottom of the TB.
The plugs that came out before the last set of 3923's were a dark gray color too. Maybe the O2 sensors are going bad and it's leaning it out some?
I appreciate the help here.
Jimmy
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GB2000
GenIII
2/20/2008
17:45:03
| RE: 180Tstat in stock engine
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Something's not right if you were pinging with the 3923's...those are 1 heat range cooler. I was under the impression the 5224's are stock heat range, but I may be wrong.
You could try the NGK FR5-1's...Larry recommends Halo plugs, but most people aren't willing to shell out ~$10/plug. He also recommends the FR-5's for us cheap skates, they're a few bucks a plug and he says they offer the most noticeable improvements aside from the Halo plugs. I'm running the NGK's in my truck and they work well. I also didn't have much luck with the 3923's...didn't ping, just ran kinda rough.
The 180 t-stat should help as well...I thought I posted in your other thread bout the intake, but I must have forgot to submit it. Ignore what I said about the open element intake that I'm using...I thought someone else had hijacked your thread mentioning getting a new intake out of the blue so I replied with what I'd recommend over that (assuming the truck was running fine as is). What I'm running certainly wouldn't help your pinging problems...probably would make them worse since you're pulling in a lot of the warm air off the engine.
You may wanna get your truck checked out with a mechanic if you've tried all the basic ping-prevention methods and still aren't getting too lucky. If you replace your O2 sensors, make sure you get NTK brand...not Bosch or anything else. Certain brands of O2 sensors don't work real well in our trucks...Larry was talking about how when they check them out with an oscilliscope (sp?), the patterns are way off or something like that. NTK (made by NGK) O2 sensors aren't too expensive and they work good on our vehicles. Good luck figuring out your issues.
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Problem Child
GenIII
2/20/2008
17:57:59
| RE: 180Tstat in stock engine
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Maybe I missed something, but all replies are good. Have you tried to change your fuel? different brand, diferent octane? Might be that simple.
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hey guys
Dodge Dakota
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2/20/2008
18:05:10
| RE: 180Tstat in stock engine
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autolite 3923 1 colder
3924 stock
NGK Vpower
FR5 1 colder
FR4 stock
just my 3 pennies but my truck did still ping a bit with the 3923s
didnt with the FR5s sorry cant tell you why
& PS
if you dont use new wires cap & rotor also
your only wasting your time
get brass insert cap & rotor
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Jimmy9190
Dodge Dakota
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2/20/2008
18:45:57
| RE: 180Tstat in stock engine
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Message:
Thanks for all the replies. The ping is not too bad, but it is present under a light throttle and at highway speeds. I know I had posted in another thread about it, I just don't know whether the 180 tstat will work in my stock motor. A lot of the guys using them have mods I don't plan on doing to my truck. The ping disappeared when I put in a tank of Texaco 89 Octaine gas. I always use Chevron or Sunoco gas, and occaisionally Texaco. I do not want to have to use 89 octaine because it's expensive and I want to find the cause of the problem and fix it. Truck was doing fine on 87 octaine, the ping just came back not long ago. I am thinking there is carbon build up that the Sea foam didn't clean out. So I am also considering having the BG induction service done to help de-carb it. I had that done 2 years ago when I bought my Dakota and it helped.
I tried NGK FR5's and they didn't help. I read here that the 180 tstat will ruin the MPG. If anyone has any info on that I'd appreciate it. GB2000, did the cold air intake make a difference with ping in your truck? I found a good link to a home brew one with a K&N cone filter. I could make that for less than $50. How long do O2 sensors last normally?
I really appreciate the help here.
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GB2000
GenIII
2/20/2008
21:30:42
| RE: 180Tstat in stock engine
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Message:
You should have no problems with a 180 thermo in a stock motor...the only thing you MAY notice is a slight decrease in gas mileage (bout 2mpg). Some have noticed this decrease and others haven't. I didn't really notice much of a difference.
My intake really isn't a "cold" air intake and could be a problem for you...if you have a functional cowl induction hood, it'd prolly be REAL good, but on a stock vehicle...it'll just make your pinging worse. Personally I would stick with your current intake setup and just get a higher flowing filter (stock replacement). With the rubber flap and the elbow from the airbox removed, it's prolly drawing in cooler air than what that "cold air intake" you mentioned in the other post would.
Ummm...it's possible you have a excess carbon build-up, but I don't there's a larger problem somewhere. You're getting an awful lot of pinging for it to be one of the common problems...especially since most common remedies don't work.
If your gas prices are the same as they are around here...$.10/gallon difference between octanes, it'll be worth that extra $2.00 at the pump to fill up with 89 octane than what the damage from frequent pinging is gonna cost ya down the road. Assuming that fixes your problems. I'm currently running a Superchips tuner on the peformance setting so I gotta run 91 or 92 octane (can't remember which) minimum.
I've never had a pinging problem in my truck except for once when I got bad gas. After refilling the tank, it went away and never returned. ...and I even have my stock 195*F thermostat, my crankshaft position sensor moved to add a few degrees of timing, plus the superchips tuner adding timing...and NGK FR5 plugs. All that and STILL no pinging at all.
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