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TEAMFAST
Dodge Dakota
8/12/2001
00:21:15
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 Subject: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
IP: Logged
Message:
For those of us with air conditioning, hp is at the change of a belt, one meant for a similar truck without air so it bypasses the a/c pulley. My question is, how much HP is there to be gained? and is it true that your engine loses this power wether or not the a/c is turned on or off? I heard it used less power if you had it on full.
01 2WD V8 5SPD REG CAB W/BUCKETS AIR AND POSI.
"NEEDS TWO REAR TIRES"
best offer.
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Billybob
Dodge Dakota
8/12/2001
09:40:12
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
DC and a lot of other auto mfgs. put a full throttle A/C cutoff switch on thier autos to temorarily turn of the power to your A/C clutch at WOT so in a situation where you ned all the power you have it. It does not turn off the fan that blows cold into your cabin, it only turns off the clutch for a few seconds. So with that info what is your real question?
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bernd
Gen III
8/12/2001
13:27:04
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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The A/C does not cut-off under WOT with the factory PCM and only for 6 seconds with the Mopar PCM.
Already tested that on several 97-2001 models.
1997 Dodge Dakota SLT - V6
Supercharged @ 10#
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CyberWolf
Dodge Dakota
8/12/2001
13:44:06
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Does it cut off at a certain RPM? I think my old mustang cut off when you hit a certain RPM. I don't think it had anything to do with WOT.
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CW
Dodge Dakota
8/12/2001
14:20:49
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Juat turn your heater knob to the off position, it won't turn on then. Thats the cheapest way, and you still have A/C when you want it.
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
8/13/2001
00:29:07
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
It still will rob some HP to turn the AC even if the compressor is not engaged. Granted it's not nearly as much as if it were on, but it's still some. I used a short belt to bypass the AC and power stearing on my 93 Dakota 318 at the track. I got to the point I could switch belts in a few minutes. It's a pain turning in the staging lanes but you don't even miss it after that.
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Jeffster
Dodge Dakota
8/13/2001
04:10:13
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
I have no AC. He he he he. That mod gained me a few ponies and $700 cash for other mod's.
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andy_bosi
Dodge Dakota
8/13/2001
11:45:43
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Let's see...
I ordered my 01' QC ***WITH*** air. Now, to gain a few HP, I will bypass it....
Next, remove to backseat to reduce weight?
/Andy
01 QC, 3.9L V6, 4x4, 3.92 LSD, 5 spd
180 T-stat, autolite 3923 plugs; MSD 6A & 8680; Mech fan removed
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TEAMFAST
Dodge Dakota
8/13/2001
22:07:34
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
I wasnt aware of the wot thing. AC will restrict
ponies wether or not it is turned on right? the
engine is still moving that pulley or are we
saying that a clutch disengages it to move
freely when no air is on or in cases of wide
open throttle?
Oh and andi bosi, after removing your rear
bench, try removing the passenger seat,
console, carpeting window cranks and door
panels, also switch glass for well, nothing.
Call me if you need any more tips...
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brucep
Dodge Dakota
8/13/2001
22:15:46
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
The AC compressor is COMPLETELY DISENGAUGED and the pully is freewheeling when not turned on.
It wastes no more power than any idler pulley such as the belt tensioner pulley.
SO.... you can gain 5-8 HP for FREE by just turning off your AC.
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
8/14/2001
00:07:59
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Turning that relitatively heavy pully at 5000 RPM is probably robbing more HP then you'd imagine. Sure it's easy to spin with you hand when the belt's off but, how much energy does it take to move that puppy up to over 5000 rpm (as it is a smaller pully then the crank and therefore spinning as fast as say 8000 rpm. Granted if it's engaged it takes much more, but it still takes some even freewheeling. Ever notice how easily an alternator turns? Now try putting a simple lightbulb load on it and try. Another reason to turn off all electrical loads when going for that very best 1/4 mile run. It is free to do, or maybe $10 for a belt, and seems much easier then going with a underdrive pully set that may not even give back as much power as a short belt does.
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TEAMFAST
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/05/2002
18:02:09
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Service Manual 14-46
Throttle position sensor...
"The PCMneeds to identify the actions and
position of the throttle blade at all times. This
information is needed to assist in performing
the following calculations
-ignition timing advance.
-yadda
-yadda
-yadda
-A/C WOT cutoff (certain automatic
transmissions only).
5 SPDS SHOULD BENEFIT FROM BELT
SWAP!
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/05/2002
20:10:43
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
On my 93 5.2 and my 2000 R/T the A/C did not cut off at WOT until after upgrading to the MP PCM. My Dodge neon 5-speed did cut out the A/C at WOT. It just depends on the car. Turning off the A/C manually will obviously turn off the A/C, but certain settings, like defrost, still will run the A/C even on a car (like the neon) with a A/C on-off button. It still seems like a short belt (which costs $10 and takes 2 minutes to install) would be the best for all out performance, you can also bypass the powersteering pump as well.
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oetkenjc
R/T
3/05/2002
21:12:02
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Now you're thinkin Andy ! lol
jonathan
Best Run: .520rt, 2.138 60foot, 15.041secs @ 89.44mph
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CW
GenIII
3/05/2002
21:25:33
|  RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Too much of a pain in the a$$. I will wire a A/C cut out switch sometime when I am bored.
2001 RC 4.7 5sp 9.25" 3.92 LSD
Ported 68mm throttle body, IAT adjuster, 3" flowmaster cat back, TPS @ .76V, 4" cold air, Roadmaster active suspention, Removed Third cat. Electric fan Convertion, HO cams installed.
Working on adjustable fuel pressure with return.
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slowblack
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/05/2002
23:29:00
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
if i bypass the a/c pulley what size belt should i get?????
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kota on 20s
GenIII
3/05/2002
23:35:42
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
just get one for a dakota without ac
eric
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TEAMFAST
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/05/2002
23:42:19
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Remember to run your a/c belt once in a while
though, You have to exercise it otherwise
seals and compressors will fail down the line.
Also a good idea once a week to run A/c in the
winter when it doesnt get used much.
Sort of like the throw it in 4x4 in the summer if
your not a big offroader so the seals stay
lubed.
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drtswinger
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/05/2002
23:43:46
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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the money you spend on a belt your just throwing away in my opinion. as long as the a/c is off, the clutch spins freely and any horsepower drag caused by it wouldnt even be noticable. maybe 1-2 hp if at all. my 2 cents.
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/05/2002
23:50:40
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Yeh, but if you bypass the power steering pump, that has to be worth something. Any peice you have to spin on the motor is worth it's weight times ten which means every pound you don't have to spin is worth 1 HP. Also the power steering pump is moving fluid as well. I'm sure there is 5 HP to be had there, and if every mod was $2 for every horsepower we would all have a lot more money in our pockets right now!
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zanderoff
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/06/2002
00:04:34
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
it seems to me that much work for just 5-8 horsepower is a little silly. how much performance can you really get.
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TEAMFAST
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/06/2002
00:50:45
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Yes but you have guys here moving sensors
and spending hundreds of bucks for a few
ponies, every little bit helps
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IntenseDak39
GenIII
3/06/2002
07:04:03
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
of course the power steering pump is only working when you turn, but that pulley is still there and robbing power... for all of you people with underdrive pulley kits... it's the next step. if you think by getting a different size pulley help for a couple of horseys why not get rid of a couple of pulleys? BUT... how many of you are willing to turn the wheels of a 4000 pound truck from a dead stop... not easy! i removed my powersteering on my shelby but that car weighed 2000 pounds with smaller tires, there was noticable gains but probably not worth the effort on a truck.
i have removed my a/c and bought a non a/c belt... did ya'll know that the shorter non a/c belt costs more? what give? probably demand.
intense
"How's my driving?........Race me and find out!"
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xplikt
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/06/2002
10:16:47
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
Right, nice daily driver, damn do I not want to be in there in the middle of summer!
Just turn on your heater, it'll keep the engine a tad cooler, you'll probably gain that missing HP there. Taking off your AC on your daily driver is stupid I think, kinda like something I would see a Civic do. I personally like my A/C and I'm going to love it even more this summer :)
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IntenseDak39
GenIII
3/06/2002
11:15:15
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
just some info for everyone here that cares. just getting a non a/c belt does not fit if you just want to route around the a/c. the brackets for the a/c and non are different so you need a different length belt. the length for a non a/c dak is 88.4 inches long which is too short. you will need a 90 inch long belt.
thanx xplikt, i am now stupid.
intense
"How's my driving?........Race me and find out!"
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xplikt
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/06/2002
14:03:38
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
No, I did not mean you were stupid. It is a stupid thing -- an idea, concept, proposal -- to a daily driver. Why not just do as teamfast said and strip the rest of your vehicle. A vehicle with an A/C is no fun...not in the slightest.
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IntenseDak39
GenIII
3/06/2002
15:00:35
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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i can tell a difference without the a/c stuff. i removed everything so i save some weight, too. But like xplikt said it's not for the average daily driver. my truck is a daily driver... with a full coilover suspension and drags shocks... so why do i need an a/c? never even used it last year. except when the girlfriend was in my truck. now maybe she will stay out.
intensedak3.9
"How's my driving?........Race me and find out!"
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
JOIN HERE
3/06/2002
15:02:35
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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I used to do this trick ony at the track while waiting in the staging lanes. It got to the point where I could cange out the belt in about 60 seconds. That was on the 93 which may be a little bit quicker. I measured what belt I needed by taking off the stock belt and running a peice of string how I wanted the short belt to go, then I subtracted a little (can't remember if it was 1/2" ot 1") to put tension on it. The amount of steering you use to pull out of the staging lanes and up to the line in minimal, and the return road is nothing since you are moving. That 93 dropped its 1/4 mile time 1 second with simple mods like this. The only thing I ever spent over $20 on was the $250 MP PCM. Summer days crusing, sure I'm going to want my A/C and power steering, but if I ever make it to the track again I'll spend the $10 and 2 minutes to give this a try.
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handi2
GenIII
3/06/2002
22:11:49
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Why don't some of you guy's that like to do serious mods and racing do like we did in the muscle car days. Have your daily driver and then buy a used vehicle, trick it out, still being street legal and use it for racing. On the street or strip.
And yes, we used to strip out the seats, door panels, headliner, trunk and anything that was useless.
2002 Quad Cab SLT 4.7 Every Avaiable Option
Bed Rug/Access Tonneau Cover/2
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kota on 20s
GenIII
3/06/2002
22:29:01
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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Message:
well i dont know about you, but i cant drive a stock vehicle. and i cant afford to buy another car and mod that out.
pretty much what i am saying is, i cant see driving a stock car when the hooked up one is sitting in the garage. i just like to show off i guess ;-)
Eric
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IntenseDak39
GenIII
3/06/2002
22:41:48
| RE: 5-8 HP FOR 15 BUCKS
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i still have my limits... i am still making payments. once this sucker is paid off... it's hemi time.
intense
"How's my driving?........Race me and find out!"
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