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Waltherone
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
01:44:32
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 Subject: RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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Well, I drive 35 miles to school, 35 back, in addition to driving to work 5 days a week and to the gym, etc, so for ME, even a 5mpg difference will add up to a good deal in a year's time.
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Jed
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
02:08:41
|  RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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Ok so dump all your money in to the 4.7. I can easily take the same amount and be even faster The whole point is 4.7 beat(Smoke) a RT (Stock). I think not. Do you think for just a minute that Dodge would make the 4.7 equal to the 5.9 RT dakota. What's the POINT. The 4.7 is just a ordinary truck with a very decent engine, but it is no comparison to the RT in over all performance (Read the fine print in the brocher on the 5.9). Hey Duner my friend has 4.7 2000 he has never ever beat me. And yes I've seen many 4.7s. And do you know what they do when I stop at red light and one happens to pull up beside me? They stay right in my blind spot won't even come nose to nose with me because they know they don' have a chance. I like modified cars & trucks but it baffles me that people would drop thousands and thousands of dollars on something that is not a performance vehicle to make it one, when they could of easily bought something that is and then added to the power.
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D
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
02:14:43
| RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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who would buy a pushrod motor in 2002?
efficiency is where its at, and the old 360's are
not very effiecient motors, you ever wonder
why a supercharged OHC motor runs sooo
smooth down the track? and sounds quiet
while doing so? have you seen the amount of
HP and torque that come from the HO 4.7
motor? its very impressive, and with a few
tweeks of the computer, it becomes insane.
you ever wonder why they are replacing the
5.9 with the 5.7? its called technology, get
with the times, it seems everyone else has
except dodge, finally they came to their
senses and made one of the best v8's out
there, the 287 OHC motor.
all this sh!t about gas mileage, I think I get like
12mpg, but who cares, as soon as you put an
exhaust on your truck, the pedal is to the floor
all the time
R/T styling is great, but the tranny and motor
are old news, in little or no time, they will be
gone, out of production, and the OHC motors
will take over!
D
01/4.7/CC/mods/DJMdrop3-6
HO cams, limited slip, HO manifold install
soon ! ! ! !
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alex
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
07:59:25
| RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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Hey, Jed. Just cause your buddy has never beat you in his 4.7 don't mean poop.
Duner's got a 2000 4.7 truck. He runs 12.77@107 mph and he's not done tuning out all the bugs. And on the way home, he gets 20 mpg. They don't put that in the fine print on the 4.7 brochure because it would just piss you 5.9 guys off. A lot.
So you want to spend the same amount of $$ that us 4.7 guys spend? And you think you'll go faster?? That's great. Running 12's and only getting 10 mpg is pretty damn pitiful, don't you think?
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Duner
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
11:20:14
| Numbers are meaningless?
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Well Jed, it's pretty apparent that you either don't have a racetrack around you or if you do, you haven't been there to race your truck. That's perfectly fine. There's no reason you should go if you're not into the racing scene. Besides, when you go to the track - people beat you. Now how much fun would that be? You have a "performance" vehicle that must be fast.... the brochure said so. That also explains why telling you differences in times on timeslips and 60' times has gone clear over your head. They are just meaningless numbers to you, so you have to base everything on your real-world experiences. You said your buddy has never beaten you in a race. Did you ever stop to consider that your buddy with the 4.7 might be as uninformed or even less experienced at racing than you are? Or maybe you forgot to tell us that he has a 4x4 quadcab with a 4.7 in it? You also just stated that guys with 4.7s don't pull up even with you to go nose to nose with you at a light. Did you ever consider that they're letting you have a head start just to make it even? hahahaha
I'm not sure which brochure you're talking about, but I've seen the supposed dyno charts they put into the brochures....... pure fiction. They have absolutely no relationship to any real world dyno charts that you'll ever see.
As far as mods and money spent? I just started to type about the time differences between what you end up with on a 4.7 vs what you end up with a 5.9 - and I was going to illustrate the differences by telling you the times that the trucks went in relationship to each other. Then I remembered that those numbers are meaningless to you.
I guess you just don't comprehend what people are telling you. I didn't have to buy the "performance" model and add thousands of dollars to it. It started out just as fast as the "performance" model and after adding some mods it's way faster than the "performance" model would have been with the same expenditure. I know plenty of people that have spent many thousands more on their "performance" models and they're still far behind me when we race. Just because you believe it's not supposed to work that way doesn't mean it's that way in real life.
You said you were baffled....... is that better or worse than being uninformed?
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Jed
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
14:16:59
| RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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Duner I don't think you remember how or slow or how fast your truck was when it was stock. I think your one of these people who picked their truck up from the dealer and went right to the performance shop. I don't doubt for a monement that you can smoke my a s s in a race with the amount of modifications you have done. Not only me, but lightnings, corvettes and probaby a few vipers too. You will never be happy with the perfomance of you truck you'll always want it to go faster. Maybe we live in to different parts of the country climate changes everything along with track conditions. But the whole point to this debate is STOCK trucks, club cab 4X2's. Even if the RT beats the 4.7 by 1 hundrenth of a second the RT is faster. I don't believe everything I read and that's why I didn't buy the 4.7 V8 because I wanted something somewhat unique, a truck with balls. I didn't want to spend money on a chip, intake, cams, exhaust, headers, supension & tires which would cost a stupid amount of money when dodge did all the test and tune and made it affordable. I've seen quite a few RT's and 4.7's out there that have done all the wrong modifications and are getting little or no increase in 1/4 times. The points I agree on is that the RT doesn't come in a manual and has traction problems. But smoking the tires once in a while is the whole point of the RT hertiage.
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4.7RC
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
16:23:00
| RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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Jed have you ever seen a 1/4mile track? Before you talk trash about how much you know prove me wrong and tell me you have taken your R/T to the track?
My truck bone stock ran a 15.10 at Ennis and that night I had the pleasure of beating two R/T's. One a single cab that pulled a 15.2 and a club cab at a 15.6. I guess all that was just a figment of my imagination cause you already said a stock 4.7 can't beat a stock R/T.
I like R/T's, but it drives me crazy when a cocky kid gets behind the wheel of one and badly needs to be schooled on the street by somebody that knows what a 1/4mile track is.
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Anthony G
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
17:09:29
|  RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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I don't know what's up with all the R/T bashing.
But out of the box the R/T is lowered with stiffer roll bars, bigger rims, and a better appearance package. Second it has a bigger engine to play with. If cubes didn't matter than why would Dodge make the 5.7L and not try and pump out more from the 4.7L. Third, the only reason stock 4.7L can keep up or pass some R/T Club cabs is due to the 5 Speed which has less drive train loss and a closer gear box. Not to mention the ability to drop the clutch for added take off power.
So what point are you trying to get across? 4.7L better than 5.9? or SLT better than a R/T? Dodge rates the 4.7L at 235hp 295tq Vs 5.9 250hp 345tq. Plan and simple numbers on which one has more power. Sure the OHC is good if not better than a pushrod in some cases. But would you call a 426Hemi a pile of junk because it's a pushrod engine? Yes I do think a V8 plus Stick combo is better than a V8 auto to a point. Yes I own a R/T that's lightly modified which get me into the 14's@94mph@1400' without slicks and a low 900rpm launch. I give respect to 4.7L which is still a V8, but don't think you be flying by R/T's like they where sitting still. Soon I'll be adding some MPH with my R/T heads and 512 lift cam. Only the best of the 4.7L will be passing me or staying at my bumper. Even a bad R/T driver can do low 15's, I can't say that about a V8 stick.
Some nice clutch action here.
http://members.cox.net/jgonatas/temp/Smoking.mpeg
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4.7RC
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
17:39:35
| RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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you missed the point Anthony, the argument was about whether or not a stock 4.7 can beat a stock R/T. You say its all about the 5spd, look at my stock 1/4 times with the auto 45RFE. I truly like the R/T's as I've already said, good trucks but Jed is agruing a point which has already been disproven.
There are many stock R/T's that can't beat my old stock time of 15.1 but there are also many R/T's that can. You can't classify one truck faster than the other with thier performance #'s so close...some are faster, some are slower.
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Duner
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
18:53:21
| You just don't get it.
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Just a couple of points for Jed -
I remember exactly how fast or slow my truck was when it was new because I have the timeslips from it's 1st trip to the track when it was only 1 week old. That first trip to the track was with 4 of my R/T buddies. None of them were stock but I managed to beat 3 of them when I was bone stock. The one I didn't beat had quite a few mods and was an RC with a supercharger and slicks..... it ran 12s so there was absolutely no comparison between the two trucks.
My truck has never been to a performance shop other than for dyno pulls. When I got the truck there were no performance parts available for it.
The R/T is a great truck. It comes from the factory with a good sounding exhaust, cool wheels and tires, great handling package and monotone paint treatment that looks great. The truck has "atitude" right from the factory. It's a great package. I'm not picking on R/Ts because I love them! All of my best friends drive them and I thouroughly enjoy their company. They also realize that competition is a fun thing and they don't look down their noses at the 4.7 the way you try to. I guess superiority is in the eye of the beholder? hahaha The problem is that you fail to comprehend the fact that your R/T isn't necessarily the quickest truck that Dodge makes. I respect your choice of vehicles and understand the attraction. What I don't understand is your "superiority" complex. But then again - everybody always thinks that whatever they have is the best. Someday a 4.7 will SMOKE your R/T. When you find out that the 4.7 is stock - then you MIGHT start to understand what's been said.
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Duner
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
18:53:43
| My Torque is Best
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I have an R/T so mine is the best. If you have anything else you are stupid. Anybody that says they can beat my truck in a race is lying because I have more torque. I have never raced anybody except in the bank teller drive thru lanes but I would win because I have more torque. Why do you people with smaller engines even try and compare them to my mighty 5.9? Smaller engines have no torque. Overhead cam engines suck. Only engines with pushrods are cool. The original Hemi was cool because it had pushrods. It had lots of torque. If I ever race my truck I will make sure it's against a stock 3.9 engine because I am afraid of losing against an engine without pushrods. My 5.9 engine has more torque than a 3.9 engine does. My engine is bigger so that means I will win. My engine is bigger so that means it is better. When the new 5.7 engine comes out I will say bad things about it also because a 5.9 engine is bigger than a 5.7 engine. The 5.9 engine has been on the road for 35+ years so that makes it better than any of this new technology crap. Anybody that doesn't have an R/T sucks. Anybody that says they can beat an R/T sucks. 5.9s rule because the brochure says they have torque. If you don't believe me you can ask Jed.
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Duner
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
18:58:55
| Fast Typist??? Clone?
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Hey Hey! HEY!!!
I wondered how long it would take before somebody did that to me! hahaha
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Jed
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
20:11:34
| RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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I think I really pissed you off Duner. I'm not bashing the 4.7 stock truck it's OK and I certainly didn't say the 5.9 was better overall truck. Just in OVERALL PERFORMANCE TRUCK. I know one area you can beat the 5.9 at and that is payload. I'll give you a call some time when I need some s h i t picken up.
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Duner
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
21:38:13
| It was those " nevers"
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Yes Jed, you did piss me off. I just hate it when uninformed people make blanket statements without anything to back it up. It was those two "nevers" that got me going in your original post.
A stock 4.7 will NEVER beat a stock 5.9
and
A manual transmission will NEVER beat a auto off the line.
Both of those statements indicated to me in that you didn't have a clue.
Or maybe it was that "you should of bought a REAL truck part?
Which I thought was terribly funny since I use my truck as a REAL work truck by towing heavy trailers and such, while yours is restricted to 2,000 lbs. (Which I actually think is Bull. If I still had my original R/T, I would totally disregard that restriction.)
Yes, I HAD an R/T. It was an awesome truck. Unfortunately I raced it against a bone stock 4.7 5-speed and the 4.7 beat it by about 3 truck lengths to about 90 mph. I knew then that I had to have one!
But anyway, back to the pissed off part..... I'm over it now. I've typed enough to get it off my chest. Enjoy your truck, and watch out for those sneaky 4.7 guys...... or you'll get SMOKED! hahaha
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Hersbird
Dodge Dakota
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6/21/2002
21:42:23
| RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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Just one more response to "D" on this. I was just having fun but in you post you fail to realize that the new 5.7 hemi motor is a pushrod motor as well. It is much closer in design to the 5.9 then it is to the 4.7. The manufacturing costs are even supposed to be lower on the 5.7 then then 4.7 because of it's design. Too bad that they probably wont pass that savings on to us because who would pay more of an OHC motor (the 4.7) when they could have an extra 120HP in a pushrod motor for less (the 5.7). Both motor designs have been out a long time and neither is vastly superior to the other all things considered.
The 5.9 is pretty tamed down from the factory, they really should give the R/T a few MP parts form the factory to really off set it from the rest of the 5.9's out there. It doesn't need that 2500 Ram towing power, so they should require premimum and give the R/T the MP PCM, the M1, and bigger throttle body. I almost wouldn't expect headers from the factory as that is rarely done, but those mods listed above would really make the R/T stand out better, probably could get close to a 300 HP rating depending on how agressive they were with the PCM. We can only hope that the new PVO program will address the Dakota. The PVO program has already stated that they are not trying to replace the R/T models, but inhance performance. The director said the R/T is a shotgun and the PVO progects are rifles. I want a rifle! The other good news about this new PVO team is that they are also in charge of the whole Mopar Performance parts program. They have already said they are shifting their priority away from the 60's musclecars to the modern stuff produced by Dodge over the last 5-10 years. That is really good news for the potential of more 4.7 aftermarket from Dodge. But think the 5.9 won't be forgotten either as it is still being sold big time in the new rams, and has been for quite a few years now.
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4.7RC
Dodge Dakota
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6/22/2002
01:43:53
| RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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I agree, the R/T's 360 should have been set apart from all other assembly 5.9's.
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John925
Dodge Dakota
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6/24/2002
04:46:56
| RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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I would pull right up to you in my 4.7 CC Auto 3.55 LS, Nose to Nose and rev it up...
I love seeing people in R/T's next to me laughing with a friend inside, and when that light changes, there not laughing anymore.....
there more like , STUNNED
BTW: why does everyone think the 5-spd is quicker?
I have 3.55 LS and I can lite the tires up, I actually can't floor it off the line at all, or i'll get all sideways and hurt my launch bad.
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Anthony G
Dodge Dakota
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6/24/2002
10:09:39
| RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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BTW: why does everyone think the 5-spd is quicker?
More power is transferred to the wheels.
More gears to attain better acceleration.
Full control over what RPM you can launch from.
Full control on when to shift and how hard.
My point is, not all 4.7L engine perform like others just like the 5.9L. I'm sure a 15.10 1/4 time their could be 15.5 here. Or just maybe that R/T was heat soaked with A/C on with the addition on a passenger slowed it down. Maybe he didn't floor it at the start thinking he wouldn't have a problem beating you. There are too many variables to consider when comparing these two very alike trucks. I'm not saying I would laugh at a 4.7L next to me, but he wouldn't be laughing either. For the price I paid, going with an R/T was about the same amount of money. I can even drink a cold one while driving with one hand. HAHA. It would be nice if our trucks would do 13's out of the box just like the Camaro/Firebird. That way we wouldn't be bickering over 15's in the 1/4 stock.
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Mark Crisler
Dodge Dakota
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7/03/2002
01:17:15
|  RE: 4.7 to SMOKE an R/T???
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Well I think this Battle wins the longivity war of the forum. I'm ready to trade my 4.7 mag'"daCREWta" for next years 500 HP V-10 Ram "Lighting Killer". Anyone have a Dakota to hang??? I think there are some retired NHRA ext-cab Prostocks still available............
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